Are you ready to move onto something bigger? Are you a MOPs manager looking to become the next CMO?

Marketing operations can be a tough career path to take because many get stuck at IC/manager level (especially at start-ups). Often we are seen as tech admins and not strategic partners that have to be in the leadership conversations.

But, it is not impossible to breakthrough. And we have to try.

How you prove yourself and stand out is based on:

• Working cohesively with directors, VP’s, and the CMO
• Demonstrating the value of your team towards the business
• Owning the vision and roadmap of MOP’s
• Being proactive and building a good reputation
• And more

Tune into this episode of fwd: thinking where we go in depth on taking your MOPs career to the next level.

Transcription

Crissy:

Okay, so today on fwd: thinking, we're covering a topic that Charlie and I get a lot of questions about, and that's how a manager can become more of a director. Or someone who is a director, what are the things that they can do that can really make them a leader. And a manager could even be a leader for their department, but really, what are the things that a marketing ops person can do to really lead the organization in a way that's very strategic.

Crissy:

And this comes about because I think a lot of marketing ops people can get stuck in kind of a manager role, where they're really just focused on getting the things done for the organization, instead of really driving the strategy and the framework and aligning to the business and being in those top-level conversations, where I think they should be. We're a powerhouse for the business, let alone marketing, and you can really find a great career path within marketing ops, if you position yourself in a way that's more strategic. So we're going to cover some of those today, on what you can do to become more of a director, or even above, for the marketing ops department.

Charlie:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). And I think one key thing to call out is I found a quote online on the difference between directors and managers, and it was, "The director is the person with the map and the manager is the one driving." And I think that really helps just articulate where you fit in. Are you the one that's just doing all of the work and you're not really thinking about creating the map of where you want to go? So should I kick it off?

Charlie:

Okay, cool. So the first one on our list is really trying to create a relationship with all of the higher-ups at your company, so that's the other directors, VPs, your CMO. This doesn't have to just be marketing, this can be across other functions and sales, customer success, IT, and other areas. But having that regular call with them, whether it's a monthly call, quarterly call, or even weekly call, to try and start understanding what they need from marketing operations, so you can build that into the vision for the function. And also, that gives them visibility into what you're doing, as well. A lot of times marketing operations can be misunderstood, especially outside of marketing, so for them to be able to really understand the value you're creating is really important.

Charlie:

But then for you to then elevate yourself, you're now in that director and above level conversation, so they'll start to see you as a director that is building the map for the company through marketing operations. And then, the final point with that is that data. So all of these teams needs marketing data. You're the person, and we've talked about this a million times, everyone's probably bored of it, but you're the person closest to the marketing data, so you need to be going to those meetings with data, helping them be better at their job, so they look forward to having that conversation, and then they're able to improve what they're doing, because you're there as a value-add, giving them the data that they need.

Crissy:

Totally. The data and the story, which is what we talked about. Even better, providing the insights already for them, instead of just like, "Here's your reporting." I think that's a really great one, because I think for marketing ops people, it's hard to put ourselves out there. And leading into the second one, it's really about communication and marketing your marketing operations. I think this can feel a bit, I think hard to do, especially if you're more of an introvert or you rely on the organization to just really see the hard work that you're doing. But everyone's busy, and then even now more so with a remote team, you don't want to let the important work that your organization is doing get unnoticed. And also, it's work that maybe other parts of your organization don't understand.

Crissy:

So it's really important to communicate what you're doing, which is what you're already doing. You may say, "I'm doing this project," but it's even more important to say, "We did this project, and it resulted in this." So really focusing on the value of what you're working on, and communicating that out to the marketing team, as well as the whole business, if you can, or any of the teams that are really affected, really translating what you're doing into value to the bottom line.

Charlie:

Yep. And so the next one is really owning a vision and roadmap. So much in marketing operations, especially at the manager level, we're just fighting fires, we're battling different things coming at us, and whoever's shouting the loudest we're doing that project, and we can get trapped in that. And it's very hard to raise your head above water and figure out, "Okay, what does the company really need? What does marketing really need? And what does marketing operations really need?"

Charlie:

So try and really take that time to figure out what is your vision for marketing operations, and then translate that into a very specific roadmap on what you're trying to achieve. Obviously, tie that to the objectives of the company, and then communicate that with everyone. Then, people are going to understand, “Okay, marketing operations is this strategic function, they're not just a resource for us to send work to.”

Crissy:

Totally. I think based on the last two, if you haven't created a PowerPoint about what your whole department is doing, the vision, the things that you have been doing, what value that you're giving with that, all of that can be presented at one time. You haven't done anything like that, that's a clear sign, “Oh, maybe I need to make that part of my process.”

Charlie:

And for you, it's nice to have a north star. What is your north star? And it's not just going to be one thing. In operations, there's a lot of things you're probably trying to work towards, but just have that documented. That's going to be something that you just repeat over and over and over again to the team, yourself, and make sure that everything you're doing is working towards that north star.

Crissy:

Totally. All right, fourth thing, so this one might be a hard one for everyone, because everyone wears their busyness as a badge of honor somehow, but stop complaining that your team is too busy. Everyone's teams are busy, and everyone knows marketing ops is busy, so you don't need to really remind them. But, instead, make sure there's a perception that what you're doing is good. Don't get a bad reputation that you're just complaining.

Crissy:

Really focus on, instead of saying, "I'm busy," maybe rephrase that with, "My team has been focusing on a lot of strategic projects right now. We've made a lot of headway on some really key initiatives." That's a better thing to say, and everyone's like, "Wow, okay, yeah. You guys have been working really hard," and on things that are really important to the business, instead of just, "Ah, we're so busy." Everyone hears that, so it kind of just goes into an ether at that point.

Charlie:

Yeah, we have a rule CS2 actually, I mean we don't enforce the rule, but it's to try and never say that we're too busy, never complain about being overworked or anything, and to always try and shoot for each one of our clients thinking that they're our only client. I think you can translate that in-house, too. Try and make the sales team think that you only work for the sales team, try and make the field marketing team think they only work for you, because it doesn't mean you're taking on everything that they're saying, because you still need to prioritize, but you're just not saying to them, "Oh, I've got so many things to do," and you're just seen as a bit of a drag.

Crissy:

Yeah, and if you are too busy, if you have too much on your plate, the thing to focus on is, how can I build a plan to get more resources? Can I show that I can do X percent more on my team, if I had the resources there available to me? And also, happiness is productivity, so make this part of your talk track, as well. It's not just, “Oh, we can get more done with another person, we can actually balance out the team, balance out the work, make everyone feel happy and more productive, which lead to better work with less mistakes.”

Charlie:

Yeah. Being seen as busy and unorganized is very different to, you can still say, "No," and you can still say, "We can't take this on because we're working on X, Y, and Z." That's a different conversation than, "We're way too busy," because that makes it sounds like you're not managing your work properly.

Charlie:

Okay, so number five is, this is very related actually, and all of these kind of tie into each other, but this is making sure you actually have a strategic framework on how you work and what you take on. And this actually really helps with the previous one about being too busy. So you could use the RICE framework or kind of an agile methodology, OKRs, and it's to make sure that the projects that you are taking on, they are the ones that are going to be the highest value, the ones that are going to provide the most value to the bottom line of the company, your team, the marketing team, help them scale, whatever it is, but you've actually done the work to figure out that these are the right projects to take on, and these are not.

Charlie:

Don't get into the trap of just taking the thing at the top of your list and just trying to keep up with everything, you have to say no, and the best way to say no is to be able to really prove that what you're saying yes to is the right stuff, because you actually have a proper framework on what ends up on your yes list. And then, what you're saying no to, or maybe you rephrase no to later, that is not the most aligned to the company's objectives. So there's a ton of different prioritization frameworks out there or project management frameworks. Look into the one that you think's going to be best for you and the team, implement that, and then use that as the reason why you can delay projects that don't meet the criteria to be worked on right now, and then you know you're working on the best stuff.

Crissy:

Totally. And I think having that strategic framework, in order to execute on that, it kind of rolls into our next tip, which is don't get bogged down with busy work or even just day-to-day execution to take you away from those strategic projects. So especially if you have a small team, and you're leading that, but you have a big marketing team that you're supporting. So marketing ops maybe has a little bit of an issue with the overlap between other departments, you still have to support them and then focus on, "Okay, how do I delegate that out?" So part of that might be hiring again, that goes back to resources, or training the other team members so that they can be more helpful in doing the execution for their own programs, and empowering them to do that.

Crissy:

So sometimes that will require a little bit of leg work where you create templates and then maybe have office hours each week, where then you answer all those questions at one time, instead of just a zillion Slacks a day, which will take you from your strategic projects, as well. Or you can hire outside help, like an agency, which maybe is a bit easier to get on board, because the operating cost of that is a bit lower than getting a full-time head count, which can be hard.

Crissy:

And you're hiring for specific expertise, so then you know, "Okay, I don't have to train these people," so it doesn't suck up your time, as well, so that can definitely help. And then, just build processes at scale, so instead of every campaign feeling like a really heavy lift, it can just be something that's easier that you can then delegate out. Don't get bogged down with those things that'll just suck up your whole day, figure out ways to make them a smaller part of your day, so then you can focus on your strategic projects.

Charlie:

Yeah, and number seven is very much related to that, but it's more about your calendar. So I find that a lot of people in marketing operations, if you do have a team, where a lot of our clients you have one, two, three, very small marketing operations teams working with start-ups to mid-size. But still, if you have a team and there are a few of you, you don't all have to go to every meeting. You don't all have to be part of every single decision. If you are a manager and maybe you have a specialist or something that works below you and they're handling some of the execution, they can go to the meetings that are about execution. You need to free up that time, so you can focus on your vision, you can work with people, the VPs, the directors, and everything.

Charlie:

So really try and divide and conquer. One thing I always think about is that, as kind of a thought experiment, is that you wake up every day with 100 units of energy and everything's going to take away from the energy. Before you get to work, you probably left with not 100, right? You got to get ready, you got deal with your kids, you got to deal with all this stuff. Think about how much of those units of energy are going to be in meetings you don't need to be a part of, because you can delegate, execution work, kind of like the last point that Crissy was mentioning. And if you use up your whole 100 units on all of that stuff, you don't have anything left to think about the vision, to think about the road map, to work and maybe strategically prioritize, to speak to the VP, to come up with your ideas to build that map, then you're always just going to be stuck at that level, and you're not going to be able to progress and elevate yourself.

Charlie:

And even if your goal isn't to be a director, be a VP, be a CMO, your goal should always be trying to work on the best work within marketing operations, at whatever level you're at. So even you've just got into a manager role, this is great stuff to think about to just thrive as a manager and even as a specialist. It's just to thrive at any level, just try and have that mentality.

Crissy:

Totally. So these are all things that are great, like Charlie said for just elevating yourself, but also elevating your role means that the whole department can be elevated and that'll just give you more resources, more budget, more support, which would just make doing all this stuff even easier. So hopefully that was helpful to you guys, especially if you're maybe right at that cusp of wanting to become a director or really leading the operations team and not quite sure on how to get there. Hopefully, this will be of some guidance to you. So yeah, we'll see you next time-

Charlie:

This is Charlie. So if you liked what you heard, hit like on the platform where you watch this. Also, leave a review, honestly, we would really, really appreciate it. You can also subscribe where you listen to your podcasts on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or even YouTube. And make sure you subscribe to our newsletter, which is packed full of exclusive content, updates for events, or courses that we might be doing, all designed to elevate your marketing operations and B2B strategy. See you next time on forward and forward it on.